Oversized 19c. embroidered ethnic harem pants? Must see...

When we first found these we thought they were meant to be framed and displayed as they seem to be beyond possible to be worn due to their size. But perhaps they are meant to be folded over, belted and worn? Stunning embroidered fabric – probably wool – and, and...and that's where we get stuck.

Are these Turkish? Ottoman Empire? Turn-of-the-century antique or mid century vintage? Are they harem pants? Is there another name for these? Are they genuine ethnic garb or costume?

We posted them online and immediately got a flurry of interest from several parties. We don't want to proceed with a sale until we really have a better sense of what these are. Apologies for no measurements, we will add those tomorrow.

Thank you so much for any input and knowledge about these! So glad we found this site and these boards.

 

From here they look like MC Hammers pants.
Is that a babies sock next to them?

 

That looks like elastic at the bottom ? Did they have elastic then ?

 

Can you turn them inside out and take more pics showing details of the construction? Somebody here may have ideas about the age from that. Also, the elastic question is a good one. I don't know the history of elastic. Could it have been added later?

Is there anybody in your household who can try them on? You might get more ideas of whether it would be possible to belt them that way.

 

Yes, that's a baby’s sock next to them. Will answer the rest of questions shortly – thank you!

 

Title says "oversized" -- what are the measurements?

Did anyone else notice that the crotch area has the design on the fabric running in the opposite direction from the legs-to-waistband fabric? Perhaps it's for "contrast," but matching fabric direction (or in this case direction of embroidery???) along seams denotes good workmanship (or at least it used to) when constructing a garment.

Could we please see a photo of the "other" side of the pants?

The pants are interesting and the fabric/embroidery is attractive.

 

It's my understanding that "harem" pants were billowy and filmy and left nothing to the imagination. The harem was off-limits to anyone but the husband and he wanted to see his options. Of course, that's probably because I watched too many episodes of I Dream of Jeannie.

 

According to this link, Thomas Hancock invented elastic and it was used in 1820 for suspenders, closures on gloves and on shoes and stockings.
http://inventors.about.com/od/estartinventions/a/elastic.htm

 

Elastic is a Western thing. These would have been closed by drawstring.

They're 20th century, called shirwal, and are worn by both sexes from Tunisia to West Bengal. Fabric is pre-embroidered, by hand, and the floss looks like rayon.

 

I've got an old pair of Howick Stars u could frame....

 

OP here. Thank you for all your replies. I'm attaching more photos below (inside and out), and some more info. The fabric seems to be a brushed cotton (almost has a felt-like feel to it) on the outside, and a cotton twill (?) inside. (I don't know much about fabric, just guessing). The waist and cuffs have something inside, but don't think it's elastic - perhaps a "drawstring" without the ability to adjust it. The waist measures about 62 inches (yes!).

6rivets, thanks for the info. We came across that word (shirwal) in our research. Based on the photos etc. can you hazard any guesses as to the age of these, and value? Thanks so much.

 

Did all of the photos we posted come through?

 

looks like it...

 

Hoping some of those who asked for more photos/information/different views will stop by again and let us know what they think. Much appreciated!

 

When I asked for more photos I mentioned that others might know. Unfortunately I'm not an expert. What 6rivets said was really clear. I hope she comes back and looks at the newer photos.

 

Confirms all I said. 20th century, probably 1970s or later.

 

Goodness, I had no idea they could be so recent! I thought they were much more vintage than that. Didn't have much luck (if any) searching for "embroidered shirwal" on ebay, worthpoint, or etsy. (I tried researching further as soon as I read last week's response, which is why I followed up, as I could find no similars to get a sense of value).

 

I found this glossary http://www.raqs.co.nz/me/clothing_glossary.html

 

Thanks Bev! I'll try to search under some of the other names.