Ivory & Sterling Silver - Pen & Pencil Set

The hallmarks are VERY hard to read, but I can make out...

M W (presumably maker's mark)

What looks like a Lion Passant & Leopard's Head (Sterling & London?)

And 'f'. Which is either 1821, 1781, or 1741.

 

Is the leopard crowned or uncrowned?

 

Your guess is as good as mine!!

Here are the marks. They're ONLY on the pen-shaft, but the pen and pencil are identical in style, so they were obviously sold as a set.

L-R, we have: M W / Lion Passant / *something* / f

I'm GUESSING the 'something' is a Leopard's Head, but I just can't see what it is!!

These are NOT fake. I know that much. They're definitely ivory. I've seen, and handled, enough ivory to know it when I see it. And I'm convinced they are silver, and not silver-plate. But I just can't read all the marks. I want to know who made these, where, and when.

 

Hmmm. Not terribly clear.

And then there is the question of the missing monarch's head - which wouldn't be an issue for the 2 earlier dates you mentioned, but is an issue for 1821. (AF will hopefully weigh in on the subject when it's morning his time.)

 

Well, thanks to a new feature on one of the better hallmark sites, I give you not only an opinion but a link to a very clear picture. 1901.

http://www.silvermakersmarks.co.uk/Dates/London/Cycle 1896-1915.html

 

Looking at the closeup again, I saw that the construction of the connection between the sections (silver to ivory) looked rather more modern than I would have thought a really old piece would look. Just conjecture, mind you, since I've never seen a 200 year old pen.

The cartouche shapes also change from cycle to cycle and the ones on your pen match 1901, but not the other possible dates.

And with that, it's time for bed here.

 

Ah that makes sense!

Thanks. So. London 1901 Neat!

But who's M W??

 

Still trying to find M W

 

I agree with Baker that London 1901 is the closest in punch shape. The MW has me thrown. On zooming and editing your pic, the MW looks like it is within a flag shape punch. The flag is fluttering with the staff on the left side of the flag. When I saw the flag, I immediately thought of WH for Walker & Hall; however, your mark definitely looks like MW rather than WH. Also the Walker & Hall mark is a pennant rather than a flag and it points to the right rather than a flag to the left like yours. I looked on several British marks sites for a London maker's mark like yours with no luck. Here's some edited versions of your mark's pic I came up with. The small pics to the right are the maker's mark rotated as there is always a possibility the punch is up-side-down. Nowwww, there is always the chance that the middle hallmark is not a leopard because it is so badly rubbed.

--- Susan

 

I'm 100% sure it's MW.

I just don't know WHICH MW it refers to! None of the MW hallmarks I've seen match what I've seen here.

 

Here is a much better shot of the hallmarks. You couldn't get any clearer than this if you stamped them brand-new...

 

Just some blokes in a shed. Again.

I agree with the date s being C. 1900 from the design of the items alone, without the confirming hallmark.

 

What do you mean by blokes in a shed, AF? That this isn't a recognised maker? Or a forgery or what?

 

Well I looked for dip pen & desk pencil.....and there's others but so far no match.
M W , throws me to Mappin & Webb right off the bat....with their numerous markings ...but no luck there either... sorry...

 

It's not Mappin & Webb. I've checked all their hallmarks and none of those match even remotely.

 

He means that the exact mark is so elusive that it's a maker we can't identify....so " some guys in a shed" will have to do for now !

 

Yaahhh, that's what I said............more or less ..

 

I've contacted a guy who catalogs silver marks.

He thinks it IS Mappin & Webb. I asked him for more information. I want to see if he has a photograph of the actual hallmark (and in more complete a form than what mine is), so that I can have a side-by-side comparison.

We'll see what happens.

 

Well, the mystery is solved. The maker's mark is indeed, Mappin & Webb, despite all my expectations!!

Top: My hallmark.
Bottom: The same hallmark when struck properly.



So. We have a 1901 Mappin & Webb sterling silver & ivory dip-pen & propelling pencil set Wunderbar!