Featured Can anybody help me ID thse 2 old Beltplates/Buckles ?

Can anybody hazard a guess as to where these old Beltplates came from or how old they might be ? Thanks Much.

 

Think the bomb thing is for the Ordnance Corps.

https://goordnance.army.mil/history/shell_flame.html

 

Yup. IIRC the first one is a copy of a Confederate buckle. The real ones are rare as can be and this doesn't apprear to be made "right". No idea of the other.

 

The Coast Guard is one of the oldest organizations of the federal government and, until the Navy Department was established in 1798, it served as the nation's only armed force afloat.

Pre Civil War, I'll bet. Very nice pieces, both of 'em! Thanks!

 

evelyb30-'IIRC the first one is a copy of a Confederate buckle'. What does 'IIRC' mean on the first one ?
Thanks for comments all.

 

If I Remember Correctly - pretty standard USAian texting abbreviation. Obviously in this case I didn't.

 

Personally, wouldn't have a problem with Civil War era, but suspect the 'CG' buckle more likely a local guard unit than the United States Coast Guard, would suggest having a specialist take a look.

Where did you acquire these? At the same time or separately? Can you get better images of the letters and the diamond shaped stamp on the Grenadier buckle? Could be from any number of places and dating, but suspect it may be French.

~Cheryl

 

I've turned it upside down, inside out, backwards & forwards, and nothing seems to make any sense.....Maybe similar to English, but not quite????? Here are two versions........in some sort of code???? I give up!!!




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One more:

 

Aquitaine-Thanks for your photo refinement skills,this darned thing almost looks Russian (or some type of Cyrillic ?) alphabet.I'll ask my wife to shoot it for me-much higher quality phone/camera.
DragonWink -My Sister picked-up the square 'flaming bomb' buckle in Chico,CA at a garage sale for cheap (prob found metal detecting/gardening ?),Chico's about 2-3 hours from California's Northern Mining Areas from the 1849 Goldrush.The oval 'CG' Plate was dug by a guy in My old Santa Rosa,Ca bottle digging club-he said he found in or near the town of Sonoma,CA.Will try for better Pics w/my Wife's camera-big thanks folks !

 

Sorry DragonflyWink/Cheryl- But where's the diamond shaped stamp on the back of the square Grenadiers Buckle ? Near the tang or somewhere else ?
Thanks tons for all your help-better pics (i hope!) to come.

 

~Cheryl

 

Cheryl-Incredible catch ! You have an amazing eye ( hopefully a pair of them). With all the encrustation on that thing I never noticed it.Do you specialize in 'smalls',jewelry ? With all the degradation on this thing hopefully I'll be able to decode something,most likely with your help.
A State Historian in Sacramento posited it may have been sold to a Miner or Military Unit by an 1840'-50's 'Freebooter' during the Goldrush Era.Webster defines a Freebooter as a 'buccaneer,corsair,pirate,rover',but I think what he meant was some kind of a traveling itinerant salesman who hawked surplus goods in the mining areas-frying pans to belt buckles.

 

Heh, my eyesight is actually failing, can't make out near what I used to (memory failing too, can't always remember what I do make out). Silver is my passion, primarily spoons/flatware - lots of little marks and details, also collected and dealt in buttons and jewelry for a lot of years - more tiny marks and details...

Can't say I'll be any help even if the details can be made out, but I like both of them, especially the grenadier piece.

~Cheryl

 

Thanks Cheryl.

 

They are either replicas or worth a fortune! No in-between find an Antiques
Roadshow!

 

David-Can't find too many Militaria experts in the Pac NW-recommendations ?

 

Eh, woke too early, bit of time for a little poking around online:

Nothing actually definitive in this Smithsonian bulletin from 1963:

https://books.google.com/books?id=rvVwAqyoCZQC&printsec=frontcover&dq=American+Military+Insignia,+1800-1851&hl=en&newbks=1&newbks_redir=0&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwiAm-qL-pr4AhVZVTABHW-NBTEQ6AF6BAgHEAI#v=onepage&q=American Military Insignia, 1800-1851&f=false








Keeping in mind that sales descriptions are quite often incorrect:

https://www.ebay.com/itm/273803436814









https://www.worthpoint.com/worthopedia/napoleon-original-grenadiers-cheval-486840531




https://www.ebay.com/itm/115299955482




Repro: https://www.worthpoint.com/worthopedia/napoleonic-french-belt-plate-sappers-143840389










~Cheryl

 

Cheryl & All-Thanks for all the studious research ! Cheryl-The cast lettering & background stippling texture identical to the die used on the 'Dug CG Spoon Buckle-Civil War' and the Flaming Bomb (Ordinance /Grenadiers) Plate looks very similar to the 'Napoleonic Grenadiers Cheval...' except the tang on the back is different.Most heartfelt thanks for all the help.Prob have to shoot some images to Europe re the Bomb Buckle/Who knows where to shoot images of the CG Plate (most likely small militia company for some city/county). Maybe there's a Military Accoutrements Historical Blog/Forum somewhere in the Blogosphere- i could make a short video of my Cat dancing wearing the buckles & post it on TickTok,get a couple million hits !