Featured MEDIEVAL ENGLISH CHURCH CHEST?

Discussion in 'Furniture' started by chris klausen, Aug 26, 2024.

  1. 2manybooks

    2manybooks Well-Known Member

    I see several motifs associated with Christianity - the rooster, the cross (although surprisingly small), the chalice and grape vines, related to the eucharist, and perhaps the pitcher as well.

    "In Christian tradition, the rooster symbolizes a sinner's acceptance of divine pardon through Jesus Christ, and the hope of bodily resurrection."
    https://biblicalanthropology.blogspot.com/2016/09/the-rooster-in-biblical-symbolism.html
     
  2. komokwa

    komokwa The Truth is out there...!

    something seems off here...but I'm not sure exactly what ?
    anyone know what those fruits are ??
     
  3. 2manybooks

    2manybooks Well-Known Member

    I think they might be grapes/grape vine. Not exactly botanically correct.
     
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  4. verybrad

    verybrad Well-Known Member

    Interior pics in the link show irregular saw marks. Most likely made by pit saw. This would put it as early as 15th century. By the end of the 16th century, such saws began to be mechanized, though pit saw use extended well into the 19th century in some places and for certain types of work. Note how the saw marks on the lid are much more regular, indicating a later early replacement.
     
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  5. Boland

    Boland Well-Known Member

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  6. komokwa

    komokwa The Truth is out there...!

    to me that throws the whole carving design off....... & the cross looks like an afterthought.......... ??

    @808 raver
     
  7. Bronwen

    Bronwen Well-Known Member

    The different designs on the 2 ends make me think marriage. Blanket chest?
     
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  8. Debora

    Debora Well-Known Member

    I see grapes and vines too.

    Debora
     
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  9. bluumz

    bluumz Quite Busy

    I now see the small cross, too, and the entire center of the front board appears like a cross with the chalice within it.
    Interesting chest!!
     
  10. Boland

    Boland Well-Known Member

    Great observation that (thanks),I didn’t see the appearance of the large cross before (I only saw the small cross) I wonder if the suttle ‘larger cross’ was intentional by the craftsman.

    Anyway a very interesting and cool item and a great thing to own. However Iam afraid we might never know for sure especially if the carvings are just a random combination of things with a wider overall religious undertone/theme.

    I was thinking if this was originally made and earmarked for church use or a religious purpose then the ‘religious theme’ would be more prominent (but I really don’t know)
     
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  11. komokwa

    komokwa The Truth is out there...!

    I think u guys are stretching to see that cross in the centre block........
     
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  12. 808 raver

    808 raver Well-Known Member

    Nice piece. My thoughts to the carving is food in the first 3rd, religious stuff in the second 3rd and wine in the last 3rd. Furniture when this was made wasn't how we know it today, a lockable chest like this was where you kept everything you didn't want anybody to steal. As for date? it's old lol, the lock was changed around 1700's maybe as late as 1750 but what it had before I don't know and the only way of really dating these is by the metalwork, the hinges were used for 100's of years so they are no help. I think Spain or Portugal? I think the candle box is original but without a close inspection I can't really tell. Going by the staining where the original lock was I would say it had been on for some time, maybe 200 years? It's a pity someone has done the poor restoration to where the missing lock was but nothing that can't be redone. The work involved in making this chest was huge, the carving isn't the best but it took a long time and to make the boards would have taken ages. Where you bought it is also interesting, someone paid a lot of money to take that to the US, I doubt it was a dealer far more likely to be someone who fell in love with it in Europe and had it shipped to the US, it would have cost a lot. If I had to guess, I would say Spanish, 1400-1550, and a household chest for daily use. It needs feeding, it looks very dry. I would recommend looking at museums online for the same features as yours, you will never find the exact same but sometimes you can narrow it down. I would say it's a important piece that needs looking into, I would start by identifying the wood, maybe sending photos to Spanish museums and hope they aren't offended by getting the wrong country lol.
     
  13. 808 raver

    808 raver Well-Known Member

    Oooooh, just had a thought, the jug in the carving looks like the same shape as a Blackjack or bombard? or am I stretching?:woot:
     
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  14. 808 raver

    808 raver Well-Known Member

  15. komokwa

    komokwa The Truth is out there...!

    maybe a little......
     
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  16. Any Jewelry

    Any Jewelry Well-Known Member

    Don't worry, the repitition made me feel quite Zen.:playful:

    The smaller carved panels remind me of some Western Asian chests, Turkey, Syria, thereabouts. That is a region with many Christians, especially in former centuries.
    Excellent advice.
     
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  17. chris klausen

    chris klausen Active Member

    Thank you everyone for all the time and effort you put into your posts! I sent pictures to a well known English furniture expert and he said it was made of Walnut and dated 1600-1640.
     
  18. chris klausen

    chris klausen Active Member

    Great post thank you!! I will do more research and post my findings!
     
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  19. chris klausen

    chris klausen Active Member

    Sorry he also Spanish in addition to a 1600-1640. The most similar one I found on the internet was Spanish from 1580.
     
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  20. Ownedbybear

    Ownedbybear Well-Known Member

    Walnut? I doubt that. If it were English, which I also really really think it isn’t, oak would be the frequent choice. I’m not seeing English carving or motifs.
     
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