What is this image depicting and what culture is it from?

Discussion in 'Metalware' started by M. Munning, Nov 17, 2018.

  1. M. Munning

    M. Munning New Member

    This is a brass/copper tray, roughly 11" x 14", depicting what appears to be an historical event. There are monkeys (crudely done humans?) riding some kind of 4 legged animals (camels?); lower right looks like someone is being punished; lower middle people blowing horns?. Does anyone have a guess as to where this may have come from? BrassTray2.jpg
     
  2. Any Jewelry

    Any Jewelry Well-Known Member

    Welcome, M. Munning.
    It is very difficult to discern much, but it looks like some kind of ritual with a central patriarchal figure or saint. The animals around the edge seem to be horned?

    Could we see the entire tray? That could help find the cultural context of the tray, and from there we can proceed to find out more. Also close ups of details please.
    Is there anything that resembles writing anywhere on the tray?
     
    Last edited: Nov 17, 2018
  3. M. Munning

    M. Munning New Member

     
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  4. M. Munning

    M. Munning New Member

    Except for a small part of the outer edge, this is the entire tray. I will upload a portion of the back of the tray; it shows that there are actually 2 pieces of metal pressed together.
    I tried enlarging portions of the tray but my software, for some reason, doesn't allow me to do that. Anyway, you should be able to enlarge this image on a pc with good results. Thanks for looking!
     
  5. evelyb30

    evelyb30 Well-Known Member

    I think that central figure is Saladin. A shot of the back of the tray might help.
     
  6. judy

    judy Well-Known Member

    Welcome to Antiquers M. Munning!

    Love those mountains in your Avatar. Where are they?
     
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  7. AuDragon

    AuDragon Well-Known Member

    Hi M, and welcome.
     
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  8. 2manybooks

    2manybooks Well-Known Member

    Hmm. Camels and what I think might be Nubian ibex around the edge would place it somewhere in the area of North Africa/Middle East. But somewhere not strictly Islamic enough to avoid representations of people. The headgear is interesting. Perhaps Persia or Iraq?
     
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  9. Any Jewelry

    Any Jewelry Well-Known Member

    Could be Christian. My initial thought was a Coptic cult. There used to be small Coptic sects which focussed worship around one saint, maybe there still are. Copts also wear hoods, like some of the figures do.
    I would need to see more detail though.
     
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  10. 2manybooks

    2manybooks Well-Known Member

  11. Jivvy

    Jivvy the research is my favorite

    Am I the only one who sees cats?

    temp01.jpg
     
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  12. Jivvy

    Jivvy the research is my favorite

    hmm... not really, need a higher resolution image.
     
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  13. i need help

    i need help Moderator Moderator

    0D9B8CB1-31BF-4ED3-9355-477B5A42AFC5.jpeg
    It LOOKS like there is a large vulture perched on central figure’s head?
     
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  14. 2manybooks

    2manybooks Well-Known Member

    Definitely need better resolution.
     
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  15. M. Munning

    M. Munning New Member

    BrassTray_BackCloseup.jpg BrassTray_BackFull.jpg Here are 2 images of the back of this tray. One is a closeup of a corner showing what seems as excess metal around the edges being folded in around the back of the tray. The other image is the entire back, showing a reverse image of the front of the tray. Perhaps these are fabrication techniques that might give a clue to where this was made.
     
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  16. M. Munning

    M. Munning New Member

    I will try to get access to a camera that has better resolution than my phone's camera!
     
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  17. i need help

    i need help Moderator Moderator

    You can try to use your phone, maybe close up quadrants, or something along those lines, for now.
     
  18. M. Munning

    M. Munning New Member

    That's Beartooth Mountain at Beartooth Pass, outside Red Lodge, MT; along the Beartooth highway. Glad you like it!
     
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  19. M. Munning

    M. Munning New Member

    OK. Here are closeups, using my camera. The first one is a closeup of one of the 25 elk/deer/??? that surround the raised edge of the platter. It could be my poor eyesight, but each of the 25 look slightly different, as though they were embossed without using a template. AroundTheRaisedEdgejpg.jpg
     
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  20. M. Munning

    M. Munning New Member


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