Antique (or replica) cast bronze mortar - thoughts?

Hey there!

So one of the things I collect is mortars and pestles, preferably brass or bronze, but I do have an old iron mortar aswell.

I picked up this lovely bronze mortar from a flea market a few months ago, and I absolutely adore it. In fact, this was the first mortar I bought, and I've been collecting them since.



I have to admit though, I have a difficulty in determining whether this is a genuine antique or a newer replica.

First things first: The patina looks slighty.. well off. (I think?) I usually thought patina would be more or less ''even'' and not with ''shiny'' spots all around. Though I admit, I've seen other genuine bronze mortars and even sculptures with this sort of patina. So I'm not quite sure.

Second, there are these ''lines'' on the base, the pestle (you can see the base in the first picture) and the top rim. I have no idea what they are, but I've never seen anything like it. I've tried to do some research, and it seems like some antique bronze mortars have them while others do not.



Here's the pestle, with those same lines:



And third, the bottom. There seems to be one or more outlines of screws in the bottom, on the inside. They can't be seen or felt on the outside, but you can definitely see it here: (Just in case you don't notice them - it's the two ''holes'' near the sides).



Again I've never seen anything like it on a bronze mortar, let alone a brass mortar. No idea if they actually are screws, but they sure look like them.

And for last, here's the bottom of the mortar:




Now don't get me wrong, it looks and feels OLD. It's very heavy. It's not magnetic, and it even has that distinct bronze ringing sound when flicking it with my finger. (compared to the dull brass sound of my other mortars) In fact, my first thought when I picked it up from the flea market was ''This almost belongs in a museum!''

Doing some online research, I only found this particular mortar once - on a spanish, I think, auction site. Sadly I couldn't see the price or any details. On the other hand, I watched a danish antiques show a few months ago, and while the dealers were visiting a dutch antique mall, this, or what looked like this mortar, was on display in one of the cases. Sadly, the first thing they said when passing the display case was ''There are alot of fakes here'' and then moved on. So that just makes me even more suspicious.

The pestle also seem to be way to small for this mortar.

So what are your thoughts? Could this be a genuine bronze mortar from the 16-17th (perhaps later) century? Or just a pretty 'modern' replica?

I apologize if any of this is common knowledge, but I am completely dumbfounded by this. I obviously want it to be genuine, that would be incredibly awesome to put it mildly, but I know how good replicas can be.

Hoping you can help me out here! Thanks for reading.

 

I am far from an expert on mortars; and so will add only one comment.
It looks to me like the "screws" showing on the bottom are not actual screws, but are cast in. This raises a big concern in my mind, and suggests that the mortar itself is a casting made from an original that had real screws.
This is a common feature in cast totem poles (with which I am familiar); on these, one often sees an apparent "screw" that is part of the casting; and this is a diagnostic feature for determining that a particular totem pole is in fact cast and not an original.

 

A second comment: a brief search for images came up with this very similar item (from etsy); I don't know if it is true of mortars, but with totem poles, the ready availability of near-duplicates is a sign that an item is likely mass-produced.

 

Hey all_fakes, thanks alot for your answer!

It definitely makes sense that the outlines are cast in, as it does feel like it's part of the mortar and not another kind of metal.

I'm amazed you actually found an almost identical example. I've been searching for so long, and only stumbled upon that spanish auction house! Though it looks like either my mortar or pestle is slighty bigger/longer, and with those weird lines all around. (but I guess those could have been polished/worn away on the one you found)

But you're completely right about it being a sign of mass production. Ouch. Out of curiosity though, if it is indeed a replica, how old would you reckon it is?

 

I wouldn't want to guess; but I imagine others will be along who probably know more than I do about brass, bronze, and mortars.
I think the example I found may have an entirely different pestle than yours, though.

 

Fair enough, the pestle does indeed look different. I'm hoping someone else can share some insight. Thank you for the help so far though, really appreciate it!

 

Those are popular souvenirs from Spain. Will date from era of mass tourism which is roughly mid-1960s to now. This one purports to be a genuine antique.

http://www.todocoleccion.net/antigu...mano-escudos-heraldicos-4-costillas~x34223715

Debora

 

It doesn't look old to me. An old one would have far more detail in the casting and the patina wouldn't be that even. My late father was a metallurgist and a few things rubbed off. It smells more of a tourist souvenir than an antique, and probably wasn't made to deceive.

 

Certainly agree on Spain. The shield with the coat-of-arms is an attempt to replicate the coat-of-arms of Castile. Castile's coat-of-arms is quartered with lion, castle, lion castle. The one on the mortar is castle, castle, lion.

--- Susan

 

My antique mortars and pestles say 'hello'

 

Hello everyone, thanks alot for the replies!

I've been doing some more research after seeing Debora's, link and I've found almost identical mortars on South American and a few other spanish sites. So it does indeed look like it's a replica designed for tourism. Quite unfortunate, as I REALLY like this one. But well, I'll probably keep it for a while. Looks good with the other mortars.

And I completely agree with you, Ladybranch, that it's an almost 'half-assed' replica of the Castile and Leon coat of arms. I did find it weird that it only had 2 towers and one lion, as I personally did suspect it to look like the Castilian/Leonese coat of arms. But thanks for clearing that out! Makes perfect sense.

Really appreciate the help, I'm glad I finally know where it's from and why it was made. Thanks alot, everyone!

(And damn, Shangas! I've been looking for knob-handled mortars for ages, and you have TWO of them! Very nice!)

 

The coat of arms is that of the House of Enríquez.

https://es.wikipedia.org/wiki/Archivo:Escudo_de_la_Casa_Enríquez.JPG

Debora

 

Wow, that's very interesting! I can definitely see my own research was far from thorough. I know what I'll be reading about tonight. Thanks!

 

The little knob-handle mortars like mine with the double-head pestles are called apothecary mortars, because they were usually used by old-time apothecaries for grinding up medicines and drugs and stuff. I think they're really cute!

I bought both of those online. In both cases, they'd been sitting and sitting and sitting for aaaaages, and nobody wanted them, so I managed to get them pretty cheap. One of them did involve a very long train-ride to go and get it, but it was worth the journey!