Featured Eyes Have It: Are These Intaglios the Same?

Yes,the failure of said process is also cited.......... https://s3.amazonaws.com/academia.edu.documents/48283763/jasc.1998.034220160824-26942-1pgfeq.pdf?response-content-disposition=inline; filename=The_Failure_of_Obsidian_Hydration_Dating.pdf&X-Amz-Algorithm=AWS4-HMAC-SHA256&X-Amz-Credential=AKIAIWOWYYGZ2Y53UL3A/20191206/us-east-1/s3/aws4_request&X-Amz-Date=20191206T054509Z&X-Amz-Expires=3600&X-Amz-SignedHeaders=host&X-Amz-Signature=a8f09a9971be62509dd351efe150b1b451a3aa4de8f1255e51afd956781009a5

 

yes, I agree, every bit as bubbly, and yours does look like it has some real age to it

 

yes, I was just wondering if the testing would be widely available or even possible for pieces like this certainly would be interesting to see what the results would be.

 

My opinion is, yes he does.

 

Whew! Not just me then who sees them as quite similar in this regard. Either outcome would be interesting. It's always cool to have something that old. If it can be firmly established that it is, then it makes it a rare case of an ancient copy of a known ancient gem. There are 2 or 3 other examples of blue & green glass gems with the very same scene, Silenus being prevented from falling off his donkey by a faun, in museum collections (this one is mine), but if the original engraved gem is still with us, it is well hidden. The idea that 'Pamphilos' engraved the amethyst would be strongly challenged.

If it can be determined that the paste is no more than, say, 500 years old, it has larger implications for the amethyst. Some gems have the name of an ancient owner on them, & that may be who Pamphilos was. The very conspicuous way it is written out in full in the middle of the composition is more characteristic of owners than of makers. Having an owner's name isn't as exciting as having the engraver's signature, but it's something.

If the paste is much closer to us in time, it strongly suggests the name on the amethyst is pure fraud. It could have been effaced from the mold before the cast was made, but the question of why? is a really difficult one with no obvious answer. Market forces would have pressed for seeing to it that the signature was nice & sharp.

Holly's link does not work now, but an abstract is here:

https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0305440398903429

"With increased usage it has become evident that, while economical, simple and fast, OHD [Obsidian Hydration Dating] is unreliable. Here results of a secondary ion mass spectrometry (SIMS) study of obsidian and synthetic glass artefacts are presented that explain why OHD has not lived up to expectations."

I suspect the older the glass, the more likely the results of this method would be off. Degree of hydration depends on how long a piece spent in what conditions & you would then have to compare to other samples of known age. Having all the data needed is tough when you're trying to account for a couple of thousand years. It's really interesting that there is a non-destructive way to learn anything at all. Mass spectrometry requires pulverizing some of the material being analyzed.

 

Witness (or "witless" if one prefers) Lorenzo, de' Medici.
.

 

You mean LAVR MED?

 

I always thought it amusing that LAUR MED was an anagram of, "mad rule," though doubtless many Florentines would not be as amused.
.

 

Too bad no one ever gave him one of those label makers that let you punch characters into stick-on plastic tape. He would have loved it.

 

I don't think Lorenzo would have allowed any plastic anywhere near him.

 

He would have if no one else had any.

 

Hi,
Remember when Napoleon had several aluminum dinner plates made. Can you imagine at his surprise with thousands of aluminum pots and pans/
greg

 

For anyone wondering, here is an example of an intaglio from Lorenzo's collection. The scene is the Flaying of Marsyas. That's Apollo standing with the kithara.



https://artsandculture.google.com/exhibit/the-gem-collection-of-the-mann/pgJi8kv2qQrBLw

 

thank-you for the link Bronwen, now the comments between you and SOS make sense
Wow, some of the pieces are breathtaking, great site to look through

 

@Bronwen - See? SEE??? I told you that two half-wits made a whole-wit!
.

 

One of my mother's favorite sayings was: Two heads are better than one, even if one is a cabbage head.

 

Does it represent emotional release? Is that a kithara catharsis?





For chicken noodle flute, Marsyas thought he was Da Man,
Until Apollo came and peeled the label off his can.

Use Burma Shave

 

@Bronwen - At least now we know that your Mother wasn't Orthrus, otherwise she'd have said (to her Brother) "two heads are better than three."
.

 

SOS is serving us a Cerberus joke. Orthrus only had 2 heads.

 

Someone brought this to my attention tonight. I know what I think; any other thoughts?

https://www.drouotonline.com/en/lot...he&controllerParam=lot&fromId=&query=intaille

Silver ring, decorated with an intaglio on cornelian representing a man playing the Lyra.