B COLEMAN your thoughts

Discussion in 'Silver' started by terry5732, May 10, 2019.

  1. terry5732

    terry5732 Well-Known Member

    What does the 1723 mean? Why does the stem appear sheet wrapped?
    5-3/8" long. 8.87 grams. The joining to the bowl is almost invisible.
    coleman 007.JPG coleman 008.JPG coleman 001.JPG coleman 002.JPG coleman 005.JPG coleman 003.JPG coleman 006.JPG coleman 004.JPG
     
  2. Bakersgma

    Bakersgma Well-Known Member

    The combination of markings makes no sense. Benjamin Coleman was working in the late 1700's and early 1800's in New Jersey and New York - he's the only B Coleman in the references I checked and the documented marks for him match what I see on your spoon. Why the spoon would be engraved with a 1723 date is a puzzle.

    I suspect some kind of fakery, but not sure what or how.
     
    judy likes this.
  3. terry5732

    terry5732 Well-Known Member

    On second look, it appears to be S COLEMAN. And you can see the line running through it like the edge of a sheet.
     
    judy likes this.
  4. Bakersgma

    Bakersgma Well-Known Member

    Hmmmm. There is also an S. Coleman (a relation to Benjamin ? but no full name given) - again early 1800's. I agree that a second look makes it look cobbled together.
     
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  5. DragonflyWink

    DragonflyWink Well-Known Member

    Figtree3, sabre123, komokwa and 2 others like this.
  6. DragonflyWink

    DragonflyWink Well-Known Member

    No idea why that date would have been engraved, or why the 'fold' on the stem would be present. Not sure what you mean by the 'joining to the bowl' - was it damaged and the bowl soldered back on? Perhaps someone did some faulty repair on the handle?

    ~Cheryl
     
    judy likes this.
  7. Bakersgma

    Bakersgma Well-Known Member

    Thanks, Cheryl. I had "lost" the bookmark to that site, but I've got it back now!
     
  8. evelyb30

    evelyb30 Well-Known Member

    That might have been someone's birth date rather than the date the spoon was given.
     
  9. Hollyblue

    Hollyblue Well-Known Member

    The engraving was done by 2 different people,the date is good and the initials look like they were done with a screw driver.
     
    sabre123 likes this.
  10. evelyb30

    evelyb30 Well-Known Member

    Possibly were! When it comes to old silver or old jewelry, nothing surprises me.
     
  11. terry5732

    terry5732 Well-Known Member

    "The third spoon has the “coffin-lid” handle, thought to have been given to relatives and friends of the deceased instead of the usual mourning ring", so maybe birth year of the deceased.
     
  12. DragonflyWink

    DragonflyWink Well-Known Member

    It was unavailable for a year or so, good to see it back up...


    That comes from a 1941 article, and the key phrase there is "thought to", coffin-end spoons were also thought to be designed in honor of George Washington's death in late 1799, since the general dating of this shape is the early 19th century - but American examples from earlier in the 1790s exist, and the same form exists in English and other European examples dating to the early 19th century (it was really only in fashion for a couple of decades). While there are funeral spoons, originally given to the pall-bearers, from the same era as this piece, as well as much, much earlier (a tradition particularly among the New York Dutch families), they would be engraved with the deceased's name and date of death rather than birth.

    Here are some examples from around the same time, only one a coffin-end...

    1796: https://artgallery.yale.edu/collections/objects/36658

    1789: https://artgallery.yale.edu/collections/objects/44762

    1808: https://artgallery.yale.edu/collections/objects/5544

    ~Cheryl
     
    Last edited: May 10, 2019
    Figtree3, i need help and Bakersgma like this.
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