Victorian student group photo… Writing on back?

I'm trying to decide what sort of student group this is… They all appear to be holding diplomas of a sort but they are too young for high school graduation. I see what looks like church windows in the background. This is quite a large photo, approximately 15.5" x 11", not including the mat that it is pasted on. There is some nice info about C.M.Hayes & Co. Detroit online and easily googled. His studio was in being from 1891 through 1935. Any guesses at what year the photo was taken and what the writing on the back of the photo says? Thanks so much!

 

Confirmation Class, maybe? Mexicans don't give diplomas, but maybe Anglos do?

 

Thanks for the guess, that seems possible. I suppose it could also be a church school that only went through eighth grade as mine did.

 

Ahhhhh... yes!

 

Do you think the first part might say ____ + gilt frame?

 

To me the boys/young men look so much younger than (most of) the females and yet even the older-looking females are holding certificates/diplomas(?).

 

At first I, too, thought there was an age range of children. But the more I examine the photo, the more I believe it's a group of kids who may be in approximately eight grade. When I think back to eighth grade there was a wide variety of maturity among the kids.
I'm wondering if the writing on the back under the #86 says St -something- School?

 

A lot of kids never went past 8th grade back then, some not even past elementary school. Only well-off families could afford having kids still in school and not helping to support the household.

 

These kids appear expensively dressed.

 

A lot of times, even in well off families, 8th grade is as far as the girls went. They were expected to go home and keep house and get married sooner rather than later. It could be a Sunday School graduation, which would explain both the ages and the fancy clothes. Sunday best and all that. A lot of main line denominations held them and gave out diplomas.

 

I vote 8th grade graduation. At that age girls tend to be more mature and taller than the boys. As to date, my guess would be around 1908-1910. Need to wait for Fig, she good on dating fashion styles. I have a pic of my father's 1910 8th grade graduation from public school in Putnam, CT. As others have said, 8th grade graduation was a big deal back in those days. The girls are all dressed in white with large white bows in their hair. Do note the differences in the maturity of the boys as to their looks and height. They range from short to tall. My father is the short one on our far left. He grew to 6'. There isn't much difference in the girls' height. The 2nd row of the girls look taller than the front row, they aren't. They are standing on the 1st step.

--- Susan

 

And the two boys on the far right both seem to be wearing some sort of dress knickers......

 

I think you're right.. and the second line might say "Brown mat."

 

It's good to have the comparison photo from 1910, Susan. I think the original post might be a class of just a few years earlier, maybe 1905-ish? The reason I say that is the top parts of the dresses are a little "blousier" and looser than the 1910 one that you posted.

I agree with others that 8th grade graduation from a parochial school is a possibility. Confirmation might also be possible, but I think that confirmation ceremonies are more often done with children just a little younger... maybe 4th or 5th grade? But that may vary, depending on where one lives.

 

It's pretty well known that the physical maturation of girls happens faster than it does for boys, especially in the early part of teenage years. So that is possibly what happened here.

 

We made our Confirmation our Freshman year of high school. The church window in the background really makes it seem like either a Confirmation or graduation from a religious school. My mother was born in 1909 and went to a one-room school house so it's possible they graduated together and they might be different ages.

 

Good possibility!